jays76

Fair enough and I can see how that looks but halfway through the day I said I was putting the kidding aside and we began having an engaging chat about JDL/Nolin. Sure I spelled Osuna "Asuna" but what is that some unforgivable faux pas on these baseball threads or something? I was serious in our discussions without put ons, I really do feel JDL is not overly expensive nor are we giving up too much by offering our 6th best arm on the farm and a few lower ranked accessories. Yes I know everybody hates the W/L loss factor but the main reason for inclusion was to signify the big league experience in comparison to Nolin, I wasn't using it in the context of being the focal point of his pitching ability. My bad with the Hutch troll, I'm not his biggest fan and throw him into every trade discussion. That obviously blurred the line today so I could see how your now jumping on every little thing regarding thread etiquette (misspelling names, W/L, etc) and thinking I'm on a troll warpath. Fair enough

First of all what is Intangibbles? For a guy looking down on me for misspelling a name that's pretty ironic. Why doesn't it mean anything, why are they ridiculous trade proposals? Because the almighty GD thinks so and heaven forbid I misspelled a name so there goes my argument. I thought this was a place where people could objectively discuss baseball topics and not get self righteous and petty when they don't agree with another person's opinion. I thought you were better than that, guess not..

Why so serious? I would've figured the guy with pic of a dude holding a gat to a helpless girls face would definitely have a sense of humor.

Essentially just to highlight the Happ-esque side of his potential when the powerless downhill fastball isn't moving. JDL isn't elite and he's getting up there for sure but I like his consistency and experience at this level. He's been to the playoffs before and doesn't get rattled often as he's seen it all now. I really think there's a lot of intangibles that go along with that and he'd go from the ace of the Rockies who has put up winning records year after year on a losing team to our no.3 starter (possible no.2 if he really flourishes). What is that worth monetarily to this team? Well he's owed 4M for the rest of this season and 10-15M next season (essentially Ervin Santana money) if we choose to re-sign him. What does it mean to our farm? Nolin is rated as our 6th best arm and in my proposal any other arms included would be rated lower than that. I would gauge it as a worthwhile move but I can respect if you and others disagree. Either way I'm sure the Rockies would never bite anyways, they'd probably request a way more prestigious headliner (Sanchez, Asuna, or Norris) which we can all agree would be an overpay.

Really, are you putting me on now? I've been over discussing JDL way too much today but I guess I brought this all on myself. Imo he's a proven major leaguer with at least a couple decent seasons left who's performed at a consistent level for a number of years as the staff ace in a hitter friendly ballpark. I was purposely a little over the top with my assessment of him earlier today when having some fun but I do respect his game. Sean Nolin is a mystery for me, yes he's been successful for the FisherCats but will that translate into the majors? He got lit up for 6 runs in 1 inning last year posting a 40.5 ERA in his debut. I would never hold that against him because it was one outing but he reminds me a lot of J Happ (and it's not just because he's 6'4 and a lefty). His FB doesn't have much movement or power which can lead to disastrous results as it does for Happ. Personally I don't think his stuff will translate well to the majors but I could be wrong.. but that is a serious insult to put a guy with JDL's pedigree in the bigs on par with a minor league enigma like Sean Nolin.

All kidding aside I would pull the trigger on JDL for Nolin and 1 or 2 mid tier prospects (say Tom Robson & Matt Smoral or basically any other pitcher ranked after Chase DeJong).

Lol ok clearly I've taken this too far.

I get that Atothe is using it in that sense but I was actually using it in the correct term. I was using it in the standardized term which is considered the proper definition in the modern lexicon of baseball, and technically if you are the best pitcher on your team you are considered an ace: "In baseball, an ace is the best starting pitcher on a team and nearly always the first pitcher in the team's starting rotation. Barring injury or exceptional circumstances, an ace typically starts on Opening Day. In addition, aces are usually preferred to start crucial playoff games, sometimes on three days rest." http://www.chatsports.com/colorado-rockies/a/Rockies-Trade-Rumors-Jorge-De-La-Rosa-update-Orioles-out-10-53-136 I never said he was an upper echelon elite pitcher in the game but I did say he was a damn good pitcher who was underrated and the ace of Coors field, which obviously he is..

Lol I'll admit I'm having a lot of fun with this and it is a half troll but I do sincerely think that JDL is underrated and a damn good pitcher. He actually has been the ace of the Rockies the last few years (I mean who's better on that team?). If he was under control for a few years yes I would make that trade, given that he's a rental this year with us owning the rights to match next year or receive a compensatory draft pick I'd definitely give up Nolin and another mid level prospect.

Lol

I don't know we're going to have to agree to disagree, I think JDL has proven himself over the years and has a couple of good years left (which is all we need). Hutch is younger yes but significantly more inconsistent where JDL has been an ace at Coors field, imo Hutch would probably be nearing a double figure ERA pitching there. Anyways this is all just fun speculation as the Rockies would probably shoot down the offer and AA & the gang would probably be too cheap to take on that salary even if it was enough. The O's have been trying to pry him for over a month now with prospects and there was a rumored package including Gausman who I'd probably prefer than Hutch.

Oh I'm there alright.

Lol Rubby De La Rosa maybe, Drew Hutch would have a double figure ERA at Coors Field.

Drew Hutchison has great stuff!!

No I'm dead serious, check out my last blurb on JDL above. I'm not crazy about Hutch (young inconsistent pitcher coming off TJ surgery) or Pompey (overhyped perhaps?) and personally where there's glitter doesn't always mean there's gold as witnessed by Nolin's 40.5 ERA in his major league debut, he may be the next JA Happ. Would I give up that for the proven ace of Coors field who's owed 4M for rest of this season and $10-15M next season AKA the E. Santana money AA had this off season...Hell yes!

Yes Jorge De La Rosa the guy who has been the Rockies ace for the last 5 yrs and owns the franchise's all time winning percentage who led them to the playoffs 3yrs ago and has playoff experience. Yes Jorge De La Rosa who pitches in the place where pitchers get murdered on a regular basis who came in here last yr and threw a 1 hitter. Yes Jorge De La Rosa who is one of baseball's most underrated pitchers aka Mr. Rodney Dangerfield. You know, that guy..

You wouldn't do Hutch, Nolin, Pompey?

I think JDL is seriously underrated and especially playing in Coors field. The guy has some really good stuff! Hutch may or may not turn out to be on his level one day but he's definitely not there yet. Could you see Hutch being an ace at Coors field for a number of years?

Btw- Jorge De La Rosa has gone 5-0 in his last 5 starts and the rest of the rotation has gone 2-22. He's put up pretty decent numbers at Coors field so I think he'd be able to transition nicely to the Rogers Center (Also he was lights out here last yr). The O's were pushing hard for him but talks have cooled down, that would be a coup for AA to snag the Rockies ace from under their noses. I think Hutch and a couple prospects gets it done..

Plus the Rockies are shopping Jorge De La Rosa who I've always liked.

I'm hoping it's 4 to make one final kick at the can this year and next with the current roster but I'd be happy with 2. What I think is going to happen is 1 because of the inneffectual offseason and doubletalk ramblings of AA this deadline.. Regarding Hutch I would happily package him & some prospects for a front end starter and an infeilder.

Yup that's too much and wouldn't even make sense for us, we need to add an infielder without losing our best one and there's no way we could lose Stro & Hutch (just Hutch though and I'm in). I could live with losing all the prospects- Sanchez, Pompey, Nolin, Norris because they won't have an immediate and consistent effect on this team competing for the playoffs (Sanchez possibly being an exception after last night but also a reason to sell high). Hutch would be a loss from the rotation but I'm not overly sold on him at this point in his career and we are replacing him with a CY pitcher who's probably one of the hottest in baseball at the moment. This trade makes perfect sense for us and also for a team that's rebuilding but TB is surging a little now and I'm sure they're in limbo about shipping either of those two out. Like we both agree on though I don't think this package gets it done but damn would it be nice!! Especially with the lengths and affordability of their contracts, it'd be a perfect push for the post season this year and next before Price is a UFA and gets crazy deniero thrown at him.

Loving the overkill and over the top adulation for 2 great innings. I wonder how many scouts were there? Now is the perfect time to ship him out of town as part of a package to make a run.

What do you think gets it done?

Well if we get a streak going and make the playoffs AA won't be going anywhere.. Your in favor of tearing it all down and rebuilding, I respect that but it would take another half decade minimum to sniff the playoffs and for me 2 decades now has been long enough. I want one last push before that rebuild comes, and with our bash bros EE & Joey Bats why wouldn't I? We've built a team around them but are a couple of pieces short, get the pieces and go for it. If it doesn't work this year or next then gut it.